In Reply to: To the Coordinator posted by moonshiner on July 19, 2006 at 14:26:30:
Moonshiner, I regret that you have the impression that I have arbitrarily deleted your post but not censured Acheick. I have, as a matter of fact, deleted a number of her posts along with yours & censured her as well. I have read all these posts very carefully and while no decision is perfect, I have tried to be as evenhanded & fair as possible. As for what you mention here now, I agree with much of what you say. This was the reason I wrote my post below trying to bring this particular argument to an end. Several days ago I wrote:
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When I first read Moonshiner’s post I didn’t find anything offensive about it, though on further reflection, I can see how Acheick might have gotten that impression. Moonshiner wrote, It amazes me that people are still searching for it [Noah’s Ark] believing, as TF does, that the Biblical account is literal instead of allegorical.
Many sincere, born-again Christians, even respected scholars, believe that the first chapters of the Bible are allegorical, not literal. Moonshiner therefore could even have been a Christian expressing this view. Others would have argued with him over his interpretation, as Mr. Don has, but his views in this case are not necessarily an anti-Christian bias. I think given the fact that he’’s an atheist, that bias is presumed to be present—but that doesn’t mean that it is. As for him being amazed, all this demonstrates to me is that he doesn't regularly attend churches where such views are common, but moves in other circles where that view is the exception. So it surprises or amazes him.
Mr. Don pointed out a detail I’d missed, though, when he said, In many ways your post started out a might pompous throwing anyone who takes the story of Noah's Ark literally into the same boat as TF. That is a might condenming wouldn't you agree. Re-reading Moonshiner’’s post, I can see now how Mr. Don got that impression. However, I didn’t get that impression at first & still don’t feel that’s what Moonshiner intended, since we all know the Family did teach that too. I believe Moonshiner was making an awkward observation but I don't get the feeling he was deliberately making a condemnatory connection.
Yes, I understand how others could feel that Moonshiner must have intended to make the condemnatory connection. However, the matter ends for me because Moonshiner has said repeatedly that he did not intend any malice with it but was merely stating a point. I’ll take his word for it.
I would therefore like to see this discussion ended.
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For the sake of this discussion I’m re-posting what you wrote in response to my post. In many ways you reiterated what I had said, & I’m glad you feel I captured the essence of what you had intended. You wrote:
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I think you've pretty well captured the essence of this particulare conversation, including my perspective.
What got me so upset was the automatic assumption by certain Christians that my initial comment meant something that it did not. They were so absolutely sure that they knew what my initial comment meant that they proceeded to ascribe to me words and opinions that are not my own. One person in particular called me a liar ("why don't you be honest for a change"), which particularly set me off because not only was it a direct attack on my character, but it is as good as calling me a cultie, who we all know are liars. And then she continued to ridicule me in a post contained in an entirely different thread on a different subject, again in breach of the rules. Even when I tried to change the subject in one of my posts and asked sincerely if anyone was watching the PBS program Faith & Reason, that same person continued to ridicule me and put me down. She never once conceded that she might have misunderstood me, and in fact, said she stood by her comments, including calling me a liar.
I realize you can't carefully scrutinize every post for instances of rule-breaking such as those personal attacks, however, I'm not going to sit by passively while someone self-righteously disparages my character, thus my heated retorts. I show no respect to those who disrespect me.
For the record, in case you or anyone else is interested, here's what I meant by my initial "it amazes me" remark when I posted the article on the search for Noah's Ark. A wee bit of background for context is necessary first though, something I'm not sure my too-quick critics understand. When I left TF over a decade ago my personal journey dictated, for reasons of self-preservation, that I abandon religious faith. Until a couple years ago when I started coming to this site I avoided religious people and their world like the plague. I immersed myself in personal and formal studies and took myself as far away from the realm of religion as I could.
Today my perspective is that of a secular humanist and I have distanced myself as far as possible from magical thinking. If I had really wanted to ridicule people's belief in a literal flood and Noah's Ark I would've done so when Susie first posted her joke about Noah's Ark, but I didn't. Some days after she posted that joke and after several people had already commented on it, I came across the National Geographic article. When I was a believer all those years ago I had heard of an expedition to find the Ark, but now with a soldily ingrained secular perspective I was genuinely surprised that people were still looking for it.
"Surprise" is a synonym of "amaze" and perhaps if I had chosen that word instead it would've more accurately portrayed my feeling, but I just didn't put that much thought into it. I notice that many Christians who are regulars here did not take offense at my comment, or at least they didn't express it. It was only certain ones who, because of the absolute certainty of their own perspective, wrongly assumed they knew my mind. It was a presumptuous assumption on which they based their personal attacks on me.
It truly amazes me (though it really shouldn't) that those critics of mine think they know me so well that they can judge me on the basis of one word.
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Moonshiner, since your post above was in essence a letter to me & I had read & appreciated your acknowledgment already, I felt it had served its intended purpose & therefore deleted it at Acheick's request. I had deleted a number of her posts below it & since she she said she found your post offensive as well, I added it to the deleted list. Re-reading it now, I see that perhaps I acted too hastily, as to my mind there is actually nothing offensive about it. Here it is restored.