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In Reply to: Re: obedience posted by Farmer on November 21, 2009 at 18:28:20:
I accept that I am naive but from my corner I see me as giving them some space. After all, they know there were reasons, hard and clear to us at the time, to leave. They can change the past for the new generations, but not for us. I don't think for an instant that they believe we are going to forget. All the propaganda is for the new and future generations. It has always been that way.
We, the first generation were disposables. At some level, they thought and think the same of the second generation. But they are now facing the third and fourth generation wanting to leave in droves, and the parents and grandparents who have served them well their whole life are asking for changes in the way they treat those who want to leave.
So, what I am saying is: let's talk because we know all about making it in the system we had rejected. We learned lessons the hard way because they made it hard on us. If you love your children, as you say, we can help.
Their answer has consistently been "we'll talk but not with detractors".
And here is one of the points I am making converted into a question: Is a detractor one who asks difficult questions and leaves because there are not answers, or they are mistreated or receiving some form of retaliation for it?
That attitude transcends generations. It is an issue of human rights and it is not going to go away in some magical generation. Instituted by David Berg and supported by Maria, Peter, and the countless of people whom they trained, it is an attitude that goes against all that is Christian.
God given freedom cannot be taken away by anybody, it can only be yielded. I yielded my freedom to them, and so did most of us but then we retook it. Does that make us evil detractors? At what point did I, or you, become a detractor?
If they are sincere, they will address these questions. Will they come to a dialog? Who knows, but that is not really the point.
The point is to make clear that they are not about dialog, change and openness. They still resent being questioned or having some of their doctrines studied, reviewed or even compared to each other. There are too many contradictions, double speech and backtracking. There are too many untruths and ambiguity designed to confuse. Their social classes, those that collect money and those that use the money, have too much to lose.
But all these things can only come out in a dialog, a conversation as equals, not a pontificating lecture from some Crystal Castle.
I don't think there are FGS who will want to leave but may be there are a few SG willing to leave. But I am sure the newer generations will get ready or are already ready to leave at the moments notice.
This is why leaves are being institutionalized. Soon enough there will be rules, such as an age range where they will go to a half-way house and go crazy for a couple of years, and then make a decision.
Coming to think of it, they may have already been doing that. I remember semi-public a place in Washington D.C. where a lot of people sent their kids. They closed it later. That only deceived a few but some people saw as what it was, a Family project to see how kids would do.
Watch the letter: Missionary or Leave Taker: "You either become a cog in the machine to make us money, or leave. We will call you a missionary or a leave-taker. It is up to you."
That is the extent of the freedom they exercise. Do what we say, or else...
The only way TF can get over this is to come clean and start by accepting not that mistakes were made but that they made and are still making mistakes. They fear the consequences but a sober unemotional dialogue can help them see the light and perhaps a way to restore their standing. Forget the world and the system and justice - they will never care about that. But you and I know of a Judge who will Judge them, and that is to whom I am appealing. Their fate is in their hands and actions, not with their own but with us whom they need to come to terms.
That's why I asked for a dialogue, because out of everybody in the whole world, we are the only ones who they need to talk, and we are the only ones who can give it to them straight. If they don't listen to us, who are coming back from the dead, they will not listen to anybody, and their destiny will be sealed.
But we will have done our part.
