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In Reply to: typical "shrink" bullshit posted by Ian on November 22, 2002 at 22:11:43:
Ian, good to see you again and to have your to-the-point input. IMO, mind control was a real issue but cannot be made to account for all actions or to take away personal responsibility. I know how much fear & other pressures to conform worked in my own life but I do not absolve myself of responsibility for my actions.
I don't know how much you've read of my discussion with Goth below, but it seems you haven't followed this discussion over a period of time. You said, "Seems like every post Goth makes wanders to the subject of why he/she/it doesn't like the attitude of most SGA's, it's becoming the theme of this board (that's why I never post here)."
It is not becoming the theme of this board. Acheiek who is the coordinator has consistently said very supportive things about SGAs and about Jules personally. Most first generation adults I know are rooting for you guys. More power to you! Kick ass! Don't think that this board is slanted against SGAs. It's not. We're just trying to make sense of our OWN cultic experience and pick up the pieces and sort things out.
Goth is not slamming SGAs. She just wants SGAs to understand that she herself is a victim, not a perpetrator. She was sexually abused as a child before joining the Family. She joined not knowing what she was getting into and she was further victimized as a 2nd-class citizen (woman) in Berg's wonderful patriarchal society. And to her credit when she saw the "Story of Davidito" stuff coming down the tubes she grabbed her kids and left the cult. I'm giving you a snapshot in case you didn't know some of these facts.
So when Goth who's trying to recover says she doesn't accept others blaming her, I agree. She was probably more innocent and more of a victim than most cult members. As you said, "If you left because you disagreed with TF's policies than congratulations, no one is blaming you personally."
So I don't think you need to assume Goth is "hiding" anything. It's just that as a recovering victim she is standing up and refusing to have undeserved guilt dumped on her. There are lots of adults as you say, who are not as squeaky clean, and they bear their responsiblity.
Where I disagree with Goth is that she believes that cult mind control was pretty much total and therefore we can ALL be absolved for what we did, the guilty along with the innocent, the abusers along with the regular members. There I disagree. If Goth has a totally clean conscience, good for her, but most adults cannot say the same, sad to say. We all know in our hearts where we stand.
Appreciate your input.
