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In Reply to: Re: We can only speculate posted by Charlie on June 06, 2002 at 08:57:43:
>So you're saying that you think he may have been a spoilt little brat - couldn't
>get his way, so he throws his little fit, right, drinks himself silly. Could that
>have anything to do with the "Please stay Mommy! thing?
No I'm saying he drank anyway because he liked it and made excuses for it (that's what alcoholics do), and set it up so he could and did have his way. He made sure he could drink as much as he wanted - it was supposed to free up Abrahim who was supposed to teach us all these great things (like chopping off the heads of other men he was jealous of and stuff like that.)
>I guess if we were to go back to the original thing, all I said about Maria is
>that I felt perhaps that she has been abused above all; bought into the
>deception, can't say no, lived with an abusive alcoholic man, perhaps feeling
>a sense of martyrdom picking up after him, recuing him, doing her "duty",
>the submissive Christian wife. I didn't say it excused her. You know and I
>know that God has her number.
I am saying the opposite - my impression from looking at historical facts, her writings and the and the stories of people who met her (some of it not publicly available), is that it had little to do with her submitting as a dutiful Christian wife, but much more to do with her cleverly manouvering to the position of power she is in, and loving the control she exerts. She created and perpetuated the delusion.
I've seen many a pair of perfectly matched neuroses in wierd couples - it usually takes the form of one needing to be worshipped (can't be with anyone who doesn't understand his/her greatness) and the other needing someone to worship (can't be together with anyone less). They feed on each other and need each other to perpetuate their own self-importance. Funny thing is they are usually Leos.
I don't think for one minute she was trying to rescue Berg - it doesn't fit that pattern - it was more like she was going after the dominant male so she could have power too.
>If she were to go in and root out some of these things, like we have had to do,
>would she find it safe to do so here, or would you recommend that you'd visit
>her and help while she sat in prizon?
First things first. I don't expect it to happen in this lifetime, but if Maria were to hint that she feels she was wrong and needs help, the whole tune would change. Sure there'd be people screaming "burn the witch", but there'd also be a whole lot of people coming out and trying to have a proper dialogue with her. People who truly repent don't mind going to prison - they understand they deserve it. It might be a good start, a way to say she really knows she was wrong. Yeah, I'd give a thought about visiting her in jail if it came to that. But... like I said... it'll probably not happen in this lifetime.
